Author Comment
ring wraith 601
Sadako slave
(10/29/02 3:41:11 pm)
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Burning questions about the videotape/Samara
I have two questions that are still boggling my mind after seeing the remake for the third time:

1) The main focus of Samara is to get people to watch the tape (so they can die, be infected, what have you) and pass it on to others. If this is true, then WHY DOESN'T SHE TELL/EXPLAIN/SHOW THAT TO ANYONE? The only reason that Rachel made the original copy was because Noah asked for it- not because she knew it would keep her alive. How would anyone know that they would need to make a copy?

2) I've observed other people's responses to this question, but it's still not at all clear to me:
It was apparent to me that Samara was giving Rachel clues and leading her to the well because she wanted Rachel to know what happened to her (the marbles, the bolts screwing loose, the TV knocking Rachel in). But if Samara's focus is to spread death/"the virus"/whatever through the videotape, why does she care if someone finds out what happened to her? And if the answer to that is "Samara wanted to be set free," then FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, WHY DID SHE NEED TO BE SET FREE? She could already do enough damage through the tape and through TV.
Any help would be greatly apprecited-- it's DRIVING ME NUTS!

SadakoIsEve
out from the well
(10/29/02 4:19:28 pm)
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Re: Burning questions
1) Kids thought it a prank and taped over the information part. If that wasn't explained in this remake then sequel shall have to say such.

2) But that is where you are assumeing too fast much as some have that Samara was leaveing clues so she could found wherein her images on the tape is simply imagery of memories and daydreams and symbolism. The marbles fell down cause of gravity. Them makeing an arrow is incidental and very possibly not done by Samara's doing. The fact after the well was uncovered the nuts holding tv came out is attributed to the dampness pushing the bolts out in my opnion. You can think what you wish and I promise not to chew out or call you wrong.

mycroftxxx
citizen of the Loopworld
(10/29/02 4:52:38 pm)
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Are you kidding me?
The original SadakoTape was mostly visualizations and whatnot, but the SamaVid is _very_ directed. I've posted this before, but let's see...

1)the horse's eye - that _is_ the eye of the horse that commits suicide
2) the ladder against the wall - the wall is a vage version of the outer wall of Noah's building.
3)The tree on Shelter Mountain - that's a toss-up, but you could point out that this tree was shown on the tape as it is today, as opposed to how it looked 20 years ago.
4)the root-thing - very odd, as the only person to cough up twine is female and the face on the tape is male, but the "dream of marking" appears to be part of the virus as Aidan sports the same handprint.
5)The millipede - the millipede that lives in the medical records at the Morgan house. the link to medical records is even made by the design of the chair and table the bug crawls out from under - like that from the tape.

This tape was _designed_ atleast in part to get Rachel Keller to go back to Shelter Mountain and release Samara from the well. Who knows why, but it is. (actually, the reason is that Noah doesn't have any useful psychic abilities, so some sort of direct clue-giving has to be done by Samara.)

Gibal Sandwich
everyone will suffer
(10/29/02 4:54:15 pm)
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Re: Are you kidding me?
:lol a burning question about the tape!!! Class!! HAHAHAHA

Isoline
shambler
(10/29/02 9:58:59 pm)
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re:Are you kidding me?
"5)The millipede - the millipede that lives in the medical records at the Morgan house. the link to medical records is even made by the design of the chair and table the bug crawls out from under - like that from the tape."

And the glass of water on the table? Perhaps an illusion still to the sources of water she is connected with or an allusion still to her psychiatric care, taking some medicines with water? What do you think?

Also, did anyone see the new frame that was flashed when Katie was killed in the beginning? I gave it to Lithium to put up on his site, check it out.

CptObvious
further down the Spiral
(10/29/02 10:01:38 pm)
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Re: re:Are you kidding me?
referring to the one frame where her face is screwed up?

slisRavenwing
shambler
(10/29/02 10:54:36 pm)
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Samara's message
I think the tape serves a dual purpose for a dual being. If its true that Samara is possessed by a demon, then it could be possible that what is left of the person, Samara (her ghost) is sending out a message to free her soul from her watery grave. At the same time, Samara, the demon, continues to harm people through the same tape that Samara, the human, uses as a cry for help and for justice. I would also support the above statement with this, on the mental hospital interview tape, Samara seems to suffer a horrible conflict within. She seems quite sincere about not wanting to hurt people, but she states that she cannot help it. Perhaps also in the tape she cannot stop the demon from hurting those who she reaches out to.

slisRavenwing
shambler
(10/29/02 11:07:09 pm)
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to connect, the tape and the deaths
I have a possible explanation for why Samara's victims are immediately, for lack of a better word, rotting and green. Samara seems to have the ability to transfer her memories onto other mediums. She can transfer the things she sees in her room onto paper. She transfers many of her memories onto the tape. I think that this memory transfer is how she kills people. Bear with me on this, for it may seem to be a longshot. Just to get across the basic concept, remember the movie, "The Crow?" Remember how Draven kills the villan. He gives him his girlfriend's memories before she died. Bear with me. Continuing to stick to other films to explain the concept, remember what Morpheus tells Neo in "The Matrix" (paraphrased) "What is real for the mind is real for the body." Put those concepts together and that is how Samara kills her victims. She burns into their memory how she died in the well. That's why they see the ring (the light coming around the edges of the lid) before they die. Its accelerated, as they die instantly; again, all the suffering at once causes an even stronger system shock, instantly killing the victim--with a memory.

slisRavenwing
shambler
(10/29/02 11:13:20 pm)
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continuing--the deaths and the tape
I forgot to complete one thing; the victims are rotting after Samara kills them because they have died and rotted in a well in their mind. Time in the mind is not subject to time in the outside world (example: dreaming). Remember the idea that what is real for the mind is real for the body. Their mental experience manifests through their body. Also, they always have a pool of water around them. Not a pool as if Samara left the floor wet, but as if the body had been dripping with water ( the water is in roughly a circle radius around the body) Just an idea.

Isoline
shambler
(10/29/02 11:27:37 pm)
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Re: re:Are you kidding me?
"referring to the one frame where her face is screwed up? "

Nope, the frame in question is in the videocilps they flash right after she gets it. Go here to see what I am talking about, top picture....

www.fuckshit.net/ring/


Hey Mycroft check this out too if you read this.

SadakoIsEve
citizen of the Loopworld
(10/29/02 11:36:30 pm)
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Re: continuing--the deaths and the tape
That is perfectly sounds *gives a trophy* Yay

mycroftxxx
citizen of the Loopworld
(10/30/02 3:13:06 am)
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Very nicely put, SlisRavenwing
In whole, a nice bunch of theories that hold up well...

In another post, somewhere, I talked about the companion scene in the original ringu. I posited that the Sadako on the tapes was an "upload", a copy/simacrulum of the original mind. So, when Sadako's body was taken from the well (in a much grosser, but much more emotionally tender scene after the micro-climax of Asakawa's time running out...), she DID spare Asakawa and Riyujii from her hatered. She forgave them because they cared enough to find her. However, this meant exactly nothing to the Sadako that lived in the images. So, Riyuji still died.

Samara is apparently just plain evil. This theory doesn't really work as well for her as for Sadako, who actually split into two different people at a young age. The idea of the "good" sadako remaining trapped in the well as a normal ghost LONG after "evil" sadako ran amok on tape is much easier to grasp. I will probably refine this theory as it pertains to Sadako after I have a chance to watch Ring0.

Good work SlisRavenwing...

SadakoIsEve
citizen of the Loopworld
(10/30/02 11:06:37 am)
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Re: Very nicely put
Yay all this heavy duty thinking and "research" is fun

aennil
Sadako slave
(10/30/02 2:26:55 pm)
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2 scents
Maybe.....

Remember after she saw Noah dead in the chair? What was the significance to her hiding while his "assistant" went into the elevator? Perhaps his assistant would find a copy of the video tape? Was there a copy in his loft... ?did Noah give her the copied video tape back...? and why would he do that? and she just tosses it under the couch? I'm more confused now then I was two days ago...



StarSaucer 
further down the Spiral
(10/30/02 2:34:29 pm)
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Re: 2 scents
It just occurs to me that Aiden's viewing of the COPY saved Rachel's life (before she knew it). And now someone must view Aiden's COPY they make at the end.

BUT! All Rachel says is, "I made a copy" not "I made a copy and now someone else has to watch it." How do we figure out that a copy alone is not enough?

SamaraKeepsMeAwake
Sadako slave
(10/30/02 2:40:37 pm)
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Re: Burning questions about the videotape/Samara
"Was there a copy in his loft... ?did Noah give her the copied video tape back...?"

Noah attempted to show his assistant the video, which prompted Rachel to take the tape and leave.

aennil
Sadako slave
(10/30/02 3:00:59 pm)
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2 scents
oh yeah, i forgot about that....

aennil
Sadako slave
(10/30/02 3:16:37 pm)
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maybe
I'm not positive, but I could have sworn that I saw a flash at one point, I don't remember when... it was a flash of Rachel in the same examining room, she was sitting on a chair, kinda bent forward, in a hospital gown, just like Samara, and she had those probe things attached to her head, and she had her head in her hands and she was screaming....

Does anyone remember anything like that or have I started incorporating my own nightmares into it all?

SadakoIsEve
citizen of the Loopworld
(10/30/02 3:25:57 pm)
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Re: maybe
It was just your nightmare. Didn't happen in the movie

CharlieX87
Sadako slave
(10/30/02 4:41:09 pm)
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Re: maybe
http://www.apple.com/trailers/dreamworks/the_ring-tlr2.html

There is a scene referring to what you are describing.

CgChick09
further down the Spiral
(10/30/02 4:48:48 pm)
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Re: maybe
Maybe ill see it again cause what alot of yall are talking about i dont remember seeing. maybe thats cuz my eyes were shut the entire movie ya think. lol not really. does anyone have a copy of the tape?? not the movie, the tape?? wait, and the movie. can anyone make a copy of the actaul movie and ill pay ya??? i got lord of the rings in february from someone who was nice enough to send me one. I didnt even know who the person was so it was kinda freaky but she gave me her address too. so any1??

Rachael
Sadako slave
(10/30/02 7:13:51 pm)
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Samara
I think Samara's statement as to her intent can be taken 2 ways.

On the hospital tape, when we see it as Rachel is viewing it in the Morgan's living room:

Doctor: You don't want to hurt people
Samara: But I do.....and it won't stop.

The shot is away from her, we can't see her face or her expression, it conveys regret that she doesn't want to hurt people, she just does.

Later-when Rachel is putting things together in her mind and that section of tape plays again...

"But I do" now the camera is close on her face and we can see from her expression that what she is saying is "But I DO want to hurt people...and it's not going to stop"

Evil little freak.

SadakoIsEve
citizen of the Loopworld
(10/30/02 7:17:18 pm)
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Re: Samara
I believe in the she is simply is theory but that does not mean I am right or you are right or anything really. Just my opnion. I'll just go um huddle the corner now

StarSaucer 
further down the Spiral
(10/30/02 8:40:52 pm)
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Re: maybe
ahhhh I see... there is a shot of the Dr.'s table from the POV of the subject, then some electrodes and X-rays, then the camera pointing at you, and then Rachel on the chair in the white dress for like .000004 seconds. Neeeeeat! Never ever seen that before. Was it in the movie, cuz I sure don't remeber but some things flashed by so quick; who knows? I had to frame-by-frame this trailer to see the above.

electricspacegirl
Sadako slave
(10/30/02 8:49:48 pm)
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Re: maybe
it happened in her dream...when she dreamed that she pulled the electrode out of her mouth...it was just a dream

Lilly
shambler
(11/30/02 1:33:45 pm)
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re: Maybe
yes, it WAS in the movie. I saw that too. I think maybe it was a memory from Samara's mind that Rachel put herself in, Samara seems to have an amazing power with memories. Rachel is sitting in the chair in a hospital gown with the electrodes attached and she's screaming....it was a pretty quick flash but I saw it too. Not your nightmare :)

doctorscotttheringforum
shambler
(12/1/02 1:04:25 pm)
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I thought everybody knew this
replying to slisRavenwing


She burns into their memory how she died in the well. That's why they see the ring (the light coming around the edges of the lid) before they die. Its accelerated, as they die instantly; again, all the suffering at once causes an even stronger system shock, instantly killing the victim--with a memory.


I forgot to complete one thing; the victims are rotting after Samara kills them because they have died and rotted in a well in their mind. Time in the mind is not subject to time in the outside world (example: dreaming). Remember the idea that what is real for the mind is real for the body. Their mental experience manifests through their body.


To me that was obvious the first time I saw the movie. When I came to this message forum, I thought everybody knew that Samara was killing people with her memories, and that it was so obvious that nobody stated it. After reading this board for a while I wondered if maybe my theory was wrong. But now I'm very glad to know that I'm not the only one who thought this. It just goes to show what a great movie the RING is; there are so many different interpretations!